Deja Vu (All Over Again)

[stilltrucking]

I am just an Okie from Cairo
proud to be an Egyptian today

boy oh boy
I wish them well

Egyptian democracy
I want to scoff

Where is their constitution
Where are their courts

How does that work
Departure Friday?

[stilltrucking]

cut and paste

Op-Ed: The constitution shows a path to democracy.

But there may still be a chance to effect the “orderly transition” that Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton has called for. Paradoxically, it requires that Mr. Mubarak stay on, but only for a short time, to initiate the election of an entirely new Parliament that could then amend all the power out of the presidency or even abolish it.

But there may still be a chance to effect the “orderly transition” that Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton has called for. Paradoxically, it requires that Mr. Mubarak stay on, but only for a short time, to initiate the election of an entirely new Parliament that could then amend all the power out of the presidency or even abolish it.

This would no doubt disappoint those who want to put Mr. Mubarak on the next plane to Saudi Arabia, but there are two risks associated with his leaving so abruptly. The first is that the demonstrations might diminish or dissipate, leaving Mr. ElBaradei and his coalition trying to negotiate with the military or Vice President Omar Suleiman without the force of the crowds behind them.

The second risk stems from the Egyptian Constitution, which gives the power to dissolve Parliament and call new elections only to an elected president. Mr. Mubarak’s successor, as an acting president, would be specifically prohibited from getting the parliamentary elections under way. A new Parliament is crucial to democratic reform, because only Parliament has the power to defang the Egyptian presidency, stripping it of its dictatorial powers through constitutional amendment. The current Parliament — bought and paid for by Mr. Mubarak’s National Democratic Party — is not fit for that task.

Egypt’s next scheduled presidential election is only months away. If the Constitution isn’t amended before it is held, the notorious Article 76, which makes it difficult for independents like Mr. ElBaradei to get on the ballot, will still be in place. More important, the new president would have the same imperial powers Mr. Mubarak has had — the very powers that the Egyptian public wants taken away.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/04/opinion/04masoud.html

[mtmynd]

with 60% of their country under the age of 30, I (naively?) believe that the youth will have the greatest say-so for the direction Egypt goes... and we all hope that direction is best for our too small world.

[stilltrucking]

As we used to say back in the day, "don't trust anyone under fifty"

I hope you are right but over two thirds of the population of Iran is under thirty, That did not seem to help them much.

The Associated Press
Saturday, February 5, 2011; 10:28 AM

CAIRO -- Egypt's foreign minister has told Iran to mind its own business after Iran's top leader praised the Egyptian uprising as an appropriate response to dictatorial rule.

Ahmed Aboul Gheit told reporters Saturday that Iran's Ali Khamenei seems to have forgotten about the crushing of widespread protests in Iran two years ago.

[Arcadia]

I only know somehow three persons from El Cairo
all young women and men
-some muslims, some not-
I was told that all of them
-as much as they can-
are in the streets,
three more among the protesters
saying enough is enough
I can´t avoid thinking in them there
and also thinking and reminding us here
so many times, so similar so different
beyond valorizations?
I feel the newspapers already exude a sort of tricky cruel logic mixed with a fainted opera
the streets (I guess), other things


http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/contr ... 02-06.html

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elmun ... 02-06.html

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elmun ... 02-06.html

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elmun ... 02-06.html

[stilltrucking]

I just got to read your links, the Chomsky interview was very interesting

Chomsky knows the USA all too well I think.

I also thought the bit from The Autumn of the Patriarch were interesting

In his novel The Autumn of the Patriach, Gabriel Garcia Marquez describes the behavior of a dictator under threat and the psychology of total denial. In its heyday, the autocrat believed to be a national hero. Faced with the rebelion, blames “international hands’ and “hidden agendas” by this enexplacable revolt against his government beneveolent but absolute. Those who promote the insurgency is “used and manipulated” by foreighn powers that hate the country. Then and here I use a summary of Garcie Marquez made by the great Egyptian writer Alaa Al Aswany “the dictator is to test the capabilites of the machine, doing everything but what they should do. Becomes Dangerous. After that, go do whatever they want to do. Later he leaves”

. Now I have heard that the military has stepped in to safeguard the country and have assured the protesters that their demands will be met.

Egypt awaits Mubarak speech
By By Hannah Allam and Shashank Bengali | McClatchy Newspapers
Millions of Egyptians are bracing for an imminent announcement that embattled President Hosni Mubarak will hand over power to military leadership, according to news reports. » read more


Military officials met for several hours Thursday, but Mubarak wasn't in attendance, according to Arab news channels. Prime Minster Ahmed Shafik told state television that Mubarak remained in power and that no decision had been made to remove him.

However, the general secretary of Mubarak's ruling National Democratic Party said that Mubarak would "respond to the people's demands" tonight, according to news reports.

In Washington, the National Security Council convened an emergency meeting to discuss Egypt.

Cheers went up from Tahrir Square but the prospect of military rule is unsettling to many Egyptians. If Vice President Omar Suleiman, Mubarak's longtime confidant and intelligence chief, takes over many protesters said they wouldn't leave the streets.



Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/02/10/1 ... z1DZpQJ5la

This is more of the Chomsky interview where he talks about Eisenhower and Egypt.
http://www.democracynow.org/blog/2011/2 ... n_remember.

I wish them well, but I also wish Israel well. I am a well wisher

[Steve Plonk]

Egypt is a mess. The junta took over with a rabble. That is NOT democracy.
"Out of the frying pan and into the fire". I think Katie Couric (CBS) was wrong.
Sources say people died in that Cairo crowd. Egypt, Tunisia, & Iraq still have
plenty to learn about democracy. Democracy? Do the muslims even know
what it is we are speaking about? (On the other hand, do we? )

[mtmynd]

"Egypt is a mess. The junta took over with a rabble. That is NOT democracy."

If your an Egyptian whose living in poverty in a country whose leadership has absolute control over you and your family and you're jobless and have no future to look forward to this revolution is a godsend... the people spoke, demonstrated and refused to listen the Mubarak until he gave up power which he did today... call it what you want, but the people know what freedom is.

[Arcadia]

I wish them well, but I also wish Israel well. I am a well wisher

me too s-t...!, and I discover lately that I can also read the newspapers at the same time.!

(following yesterday what was happening in Egypt via Telesur while I had lunch)

[Steve Plonk]

My sources said the Egypt "revolution" was an atypical army coup d'etat with
the army siding with the demonstrators. This type stuff has happened before
in Iran. I hope we don't get another reactionary government in Egypt like we
had under Nasser....Another thing, this type thing happened in Greece in the
late l960s--see my other comment in "Mid-Winter Word Jam". Only a few years
later, the Greek King was invited back.

In Britain, hundreds of years ago, Cromwell took over in a coup d'etat, and they
executed the king. Then, after Cromwell's death, the monarchy was invited back.
France went through a similar bloody revolution and the monarchy came and went and then came and went again and now France is a parliamentary republic.
In Spain, there was Franco, and then the monarchy was invited back after he
died--so there is hope. Constitutional parliamentary democracy has worked
in Britain, France, Greece, and Spain. Although, Greece is heavily in debt.

Dissolving the parliament in Egypt is a bad sign--if it indeed happened.
I wish Egypt well, but I am very skeptical of this so-called "freedom" revolution.
The junta did say that they would abide by all current treaties in force in Egypt and that is one positive sign of progress by the "new" government there.

Also, see this commentary on my new topic concerning Egypt in my "Life in the Horse Lane" column.

[Arcadia]

Steve: well..., USA can be seen at the same time as some sort of democracy and declining empire with non conventional kings or queens on the historical horizon... it can looks really complex and messy for an outsider..! so, who knows exactly? , let´s see what happens there and wish Egypt´s people better times!!

See:

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/elmun ... 02-13.html

[Steve Plonk]

I give Egypt best wishes... Only the junta knows what Egypt will do... Let's
see what happens later.

[saw]

Egypt has a long row to hoe, but as one Egyptian put it, The street has spoken. The young people were able to get the citizens to do something their parents could not, transcend fear.....fear is a dictator's best friend....
You can't organize a grassroots populist demonstration with two million people shoulder to shoulder from all walks of life unless they believe this is the next logical step if they are to have any kind of future.....

the best sources on info I have found are independent media.....forget about the major US networks, they don't have a clue....Democracy Now
which you can access on line, stream their daily show which is an hour is a great source...their senior producer is Egyptian and he has been there since the beginning......and of course for those of you that know, Aljezeera English, which you also access on line.....or you can get to through Link TV on line....but it is the premiere source of knowledgeable reporting by reporters that live in the middle east.....

Egypt has some tough days, months ahead, but I'm quite sure they will reassemble if things bog down.....not only did most agree to leave the square, but they got out brooms and mops and paint, and cleaned up their mess before they left

[tinkerjack]

I like those Argentine links that Arcadia posts, they seem pretty objective to me. Hard not for Argentinians to be wary of military juntas.

We are a mystery to me too Arcadia. I am a stranger in the promised land. A real live nephew of my Uncle Sam.

I thought that bit about "Egypt freeing itself from the claw of western democracies" was very interesting. In the meantime I am encouraged by how honest the Swiss bankers have become. Mubarak the "kleptomaniac" estimated fortune more than Bill Gates"

[Arcadia]

I give Egypt best wishes... Only the junta knows what Egypt will do... Let's
see what happens later. ... ok, Steve!, as you want it!!

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/ultim ... 02-18.html